I played against my first cheater yesterday....

on May 27, 2009

sPlo0sH

unfortunately, stardock hasnt provided enough tools for me to prove anything.

That's all i'll admit.

Keep an eye out - if i'm wrong, there is no way to prove that either. lol

Face it. You were outplayed. Badly. People have provided you with perfectly reasonable ways of how they got their stats so high. You and your allies fed them and allowed them to get expensive items early. Unless you can provide pics that show that you and your team had few deaths when the accused players were at the above levels then there is no reason why we should believe you.

47

bonscott

on May 27, 2009

Also don't forget the Sigil of Vitality which gives a 50% boost to max health. In other words if base is 5000 using this will get you to 7500.

There is no cheating going on here.

48

Azrailx

on May 27, 2009

unless there was a desync error i doubt it...

49

Phirochu

on May 27, 2009

bender

reply 8

Kyky shows 80 games played, Bronnieman shows 75. You show 35. I know some games (maybe 20%?) are not recording at all. Just by this, I would imagine it is possible you were simply outplayed by someone more experienced. Second, they both have positive records, but nothing so overwhelmingly posititve that it looks suspicious.

Lastly, just to check the math, here is a screenshot to prove the feasibility. Note that the total item costs are 10k gold, which is certainly not impossible at that point. Also note, that demigoddb.com's calculator does not factor in the abilities (4 points in enhanced attributes adds +460 health). At this point, he would also have the 1300 point hammer, and boulder roll as you described.

Here is the math shown below: [(6750 health from levels & items) + (460 health from "enchanced attributes")] * (1.15 from 15% health flag) = 8291.5 health

Reduced 84%Original 711 x 467

sPlo0sH

reply 2

I guess you have no reason to believe me... but i hosted tda games in dota for over 2 years, and i've probably lost only about 4 demigod games out of hundreds of games.... i'm neither a newb nor a whiner. Just to be 100% sure they were cheating i leveled an unclean beast to level 20 with all the best items and only came out to about 9.8 k health... only a thousand or so below a UB @ lvl 9 in my game with a cheater.

Just to be clear, my understanding is that there is currently a money hack.

so.... have you played 35 games or hundreds?

50

sPlo0sH

on May 27, 2009

Phirochu

reply 24

Quoting bender,
reply 8
Kyky shows 80 games played, Bronnieman shows 75. You show 35. I know some games (maybe 20%?) are not recording at all. Just by this, I would imagine it is possible you were simply outplayed by someone more experienced. Second, they both have positive records, but nothing so overwhelmingly posititve that it looks suspicious.

Lastly, just to check the math, here is a screenshot to prove the feasibility. Note that the total item costs are 10k gold, which is certainly not impossible at that point. Also note, that demigoddb.com's calculator does not factor in the abilities (4 points in enhanced attributes adds +460 health). At this point, he would also have the 1300 point hammer, and boulder roll as you described.

Here is the math shown below: [(6750 health from levels & items) + (460 health from "enchanced attributes")] * (1.15 from 15% health flag) = 8291.5 health

Reduced 84%Original 711 x 467

Quoting sPlo0sH,
reply 2
I guess you have no reason to believe me... but i hosted tda games in dota for over 2 years, and i've probably lost only about 4 demigod games out of hundreds of games.... i'm neither a newb nor a whiner. Just to be 100% sure they were cheating i leveled an unclean beast to level 20 with all the best items and only came out to about 9.8 k health... only a thousand or so below a UB @ lvl 9 in my game with a cheater.

Just to be clear, my understanding is that there is currently a money hack.

so.... have you played 35 games or hundreds?

i already answered this... most games i've played haven't completed. The game i have a replay of doesnt even show on the website providing this information.

51

sPlo0sH

on May 27, 2009

ArnieDude

reply 20

You cant proof anything so now Stardock has to provide tools?

What tools do you need when people already posted plenty of possible scenario's you might have run into, did you actually read any of the proper responses to your wild claim of cheating?

Time for you to have a better look at the game and properly check your facts before posting again...

working replay system, yes plz.

52

DeadMG

on May 27, 2009

This works completely different to Company of Heroes. If you modify the exe or lua on this side, firstly, well, the game crashes like a bitch. Trust me, you can't just open up the game files. Even allowing them to be changed, without making any changes, will get you rejected from the lobby. Secondly, when you send to the other guy what you can see, he will realize that it doesn't match what he knows you can see, and the game will instantly desync.

The game gets a lot of shit for the amount of bandwidth it uses, but that quantity contains a lot of sync information that protects you from cheaters in an extremely strong way. As soon as everyone in the game doesn't agree on the exact quantity of gold, health, mana, any of those things that you have, the game desyncs and is over. The entire engine is built around the concept that what's happening (the sim) matches exactly. You can never hack the game, like in D2 where you could just enter a quantity of money to have and bang, you had it. If you did that, the game would be over.

It's not like, CS:S, where when you fire a shot, what the other guy sees is actually just a randomized bullet and everyone sees a different randomized bullet, and the server sends the damage down later.

53

Anesthesiac

on May 27, 2009

sPlo0sH

reply 25

<snip>

Here is the math shown below: [(6750 health from levels & items) + (460 health from "enchanced attributes")] * (1.15 from 15% health flag) = 8291.5 health

Reduced 84%Original 711 x 467

<snip>

so.... have you played 35 games or hundreds?

i already answered this... most games i've played haven't completed. The game i have a replay of doesnt even show on the website providing this information.

First, thanks to www.demigoddb.com for the tools I used to show how this is mathematically feasible.

Second, I think we all know that a good portion of the games don't show in the stats, but this is going to be true for your opponents as well, not just you. Odds are likely that the % of games missing are comparable between your stats and theirs. So *probably*, BOTH of those opponents have twice the competitive demigod experience that you do. (unless for some reason your stat tracking is broken, but theirs is working swell!?)

And third, you mentioned the "armor modified health" shown in my screen shot. I did not factor that into the equation I showed when explaining how he could hit 8.3k (without using the consumable that gives +50% health for 20 seconds)...

Basically, it's mathematically possible, even likely. So you simply need to bring more evidence when you bring accusations of cheating to the table. That is all.

54

vindKtiv

on May 27, 2009

This works completely different to Company of Heroes. If you modify the exe or lua on this side, firstly, well, the game crashes like a bitch. Trust me, you can't just open up the game files. Even allowing them to be changed, without making any changes, will get you rejected from the lobby. Secondly, when you send to the other guy what you can see, he will realize that it doesn't match what he knows you can see, and the game will instantly desync.

The game gets a lot of shit for the amount of bandwidth it uses, but that quantity contains a lot of sync information that protects you from cheaters in an extremely strong way. As soon as everyone in the game doesn't agree on the exact quantity of gold, health, mana, any of those things that you have, the game desyncs and is over. The entire engine is built around the concept that what's happening (the sim) matches exactly. You can never hack the game, like in D2 where you could just enter a quantity of money to have and bang, you had it. If you did that, the game would be over.

It's not like, CS:S, where when you fire a shot, what the other guy sees is actually just a randomized bullet and everyone sees a different randomized bullet, and the server sends the damage down later.

Waitaminute. How do you know all this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-AgZBSI7f4

55

Azrailx

on May 27, 2009

staged

56

Bronnieman

on May 27, 2009

What happened is the OP sucks at DG and attributed his failing to an external source.

Not to spoil the fun of this thread but the numbers are exaggerated and a hammer slam, foul grasp/ooze combo is hard to deal with.

57

sPlo0sH

on May 27, 2009

Bronnieman

reply 6

What happened is the OP sucks at DG and attributed his failing to an external source.

Not to spoil the fun of this thread but the numbers are exaggerated and a hammer slam, foul grasp/ooze combo is hard to deal with.

ty for this informative post. it all makes sense now.

58

Aussieweed

on May 28, 2009

sPlo0sH

reply 7

Quoting Bronnieman, reply 6

What happened is the OP sucks at DG and attributed his failing to an external source.

Not to spoil the fun of this thread but the numbers are exaggerated and a hammer slam, foul grasp/ooze combo is hard to deal with.

ty for this informative post. it all makes sense now.

What really happend was, Ky Ky > ******ory op and then because he was so butthurt decided to make a thread about it.

59

Lughsan

on May 28, 2009

Covenn

reply 11

ZOMG I just played against a cheater... he killed me. Must of been cheating, because I am un-killable.

No you are GODLIKE... meaning you die and resurrect contiously (more often on Easter )

60

Aussieweed

on May 28, 2009

Lugh

reply 9

Quoting Covenn, reply 11ZOMG I just played against a cheater... he killed me. Must of been cheating, because I am un-killable.
No you are GODLIKE... meaning you die and resurrect contiously (more often on Easter )

inb4anyonelsesaysit

fail